Edward Weiss writes:

Just finished reading the Lawrence article. As far as “getting paid” goes, we do get compensation. It’s called targeted interested traffic. A pretty fair exchange if you ask me. Especially when you consider that most authors on EzineArticles are selling something. That’s how they make their money.

[Reply]

Dina at Wordfeeder.com writes:

I’m one of those people who thinks it’s tacky to discuss income amounts with people I hardly know.

So, let’s just say that my referrals from EzineArticles have thus far gained me enough money to buy a new car if I need one.

Thank you, Chris, Wally, Penny, Suzy, Mary, Fred, Programmers 1 through 5, and whoever else I forgot.

[Reply]

Ed Howes writes:

Ever since last weeks experience and previously with amateur directories, I began thinking of the amateur – professional question. What I sell does not contribute a nickel to my standard of living. To promote my message I submit my articles at no cost to directories, which will eventually profit from my support. The directory then distributes my articles far and wide (ideally) and new users find a way to get paid. Am I only a professional when I earn a living by my work? Old World professional publishing has been a closed shop like trade unions. Free content forces them into the New Age and the world benefits.

[Reply]

Dina at Wordfeeder.com writes:

Ed Howes, I agree.

I sat there trying to compose a post on this matter that made sense. I found it so difficult to explain (brain is taxed right now) that I just gave up.

Free content levels the playing field.

Or whatever I’m trying (and failing) to say.

[Reply]

Ed Howes writes:

Just read Ms. Lawrence’s interesting article. She has posed a question in her title, the answer to which is a resounding yes. More feeders please. Even an amateur writer might know EzineArticles is a business and a proper noun, not a link in a writing article. Ms. Lawrence betrays her Old World mentality. The feeding she FEARS apparently, is called GIVING in the New Age and is the Second Law of Spiritual Success. The same law applies to professional writers who can also benefit from the practice. Perhaps spirituality is beyond the scope and interest of professional writing.

[Reply]

Kevin Stirtz writes:

I think Star’s problem is that she’s stuck in the “old school” mentality. Pre-Internet, her opinion would have had more merit. Because 99% of the writers had no way to gain audience. And, if you are writing for your business, you need to gain audience or income from you work.

But, Star hasn’t yet discovered that the world has changed. It’s not about getting paid directly for every tiny little thing you do.

It’s about doing what’s within your grasp to build your business and to develop your craft. I’m thrilled that I can reach tens of thousands of people with my writing, even though they’re not paying me anything for the privilege.

It occurs to me that Star might also be missing one of life’s golden rules.

That is, use your talents the best you can to serve others. Do this with the sole intent of helping others. The universe will take care of the rest and, I guarantee, you’ll never go hungry.

Just my thoughts on a hot, sticky summer evening in Reading PA.

[Reply]

Lance Winslow writes:

No offence to this (B-) writer of this article who obviously cannot understand a higher purpose, but I am the all time writer of articles in the history of the Internet and will be a 7100 by Monday. I am retired, I do not need the money and my goal is to change the world. So this lady can stick it. I wish I would have met her face to face in my industry while I was working. Let me tell you we kicked butt and slammed our competitors and detractors into the carpet. I say to this lady, so what have you done for the world recently? Hmm? Lets compare resumes, Any day, any time. EzineArticles.com is great and I sure as sheet wouldn’t waste my time here if it wasn’t. She is just a Prozac, ridden maniac depressant, so typical of that style of writing.

Okay, now I am calmed down and on the flip side, you know you have not made the grade until your critics come out and scream “no fair” in jealousy. You know what SHE, just proved that WE, all of us at EzineArticles.com are on the right track. I am proud to say it too. And I would like to add; Eat My Dust, After Burners Blazing and I feel the “Top Gun” Movie theme song playing in my head, what is playing in hers? Rice Crispy or Vonage commercial jingle.

You know when I use to race motorcycles street bikes I learned “SEE YA!” in nine languages. That is apropos to this conversation indeed and before I ran a 4-minute mile in track during my college years, I use to hear snickers in the crowd too. Everywhere you go the weak hide behind the shrubbery, afraid to come out and instead shout some BS comment. Well guess what? How many people read her little article? No one is listening to her and the only reason people are reading it is because EzineArticles Blog traffic sent them there.

Sorry but I could go on for hours and hours on this wench! She should not start a war with me; a war of words or any other for that matter; Call me the Turbo Steamroller, as this train is not stopping for anyone, if you are not on board you are eating crow.

[Reply]

Ed Howes writes:

Lance,

Star has performed a valuable service by bringing this whole amateur – professional question into view for examination. She doesn’t know it, but she is helping advance the free content cause and we can afford to give her credit for so doing. What say?

[Reply]

Dina writes:

Lance… it’s time to admit that you’re as moody as the next writer. You’re like a bundle of raw nerve endings… a fierce competitive spirit, burning new neural pathways at the speed of light. Yet, when you’re not on the warpath, you’re merry, gracious and benevolent. Either way, your impudence keeps this blog rife with controversy. So, bring it on, retired brother.

The writer of the slam article is just one of many with an opinion. It was interesting reading material although it won’t stop me from supporting EzineArticles and its members.

If we all got high pay from article banks, then the content buyers would have to pay high prices to use the content.

Then, everyone would become a lot more selective, and it would become a snobbery contest, with “little nobodies” getting snuffed out by people in high places.

And inevitably, powerful companies would dominate the ‘net. Then, we’d all have to play the brown-nosing game to get anywhere at all. And your copy wouldn’t be yours anyone because some nincompoop parrot-mouthed director would overwrite your idea because he made 20K more a year than you do.

I came to the internet to get away from all of that. So, to me, the free content of web articles is endless freedom and endless opportunity to cherry-pick my colleagues and clients.

Thank you all for distracting me AGAIN. I’m not coming back to this dang juicy thread. I have work to do!

Dina

[Reply]

Dina writes:

Typo in that last entry – I meant to say “anymore.”

[Reply]

Lance Winslow writes:

Ed,

I see your noble perspective and have taken it fully into consideration; Sure I suppose or we can slaughter and annihilate the enemy and take no prisoners and crush the opposition and take out the competition. We can attack a sunrise and use technologically advanced weapons Carl von Clauswitz style and learn from Sun Tzu as we modify our Gorilla Campaign the Colonel Boyd way. We can set our phasers above stun only and go in for the kill shot on the Klingon detractors. We must hold the line and darn the torpedoes, launch the fighters. I like that better. I like to win. We must win and claim victory and attack the enemy!!!

This is personal now and no credit, kudos or slack can be given; full speed ahead. Fire at will and show the enemy the will and strength of honor. We must unite in a common cause to defeat the detractor. Slam the bad guys into submission, attack and annihilate them all!!!

Well, indeed Ed, but you know I have never heard of Star until now and have subscribed to their newsletter so I have ammo to write 50-100 articles to attack them and see that they are all over the Internet. And I can do that in one day. And my attorneys are tough and will back me up and make them spend money. You attack what I stand for it becomes personal. You attack my team and I consider EzineArticles my team, then it is time to put up the defense shield and stop the international terrorists from using their mighty pens and key boards as weapons of mass destruction in violation of the NEW Writer’s code. We will be victorious and we must prevail.

You know until I accidentally became a writer, I never liked them much anyway. Now I is one, or am becoming one. But we must declare victory and we must destroy the enemy. We must go all the way, it is fair for all concerned and it is the right thing to do and the Write way to do it. EzineArticles.com must not allow detraction from the destiny that awaits!!! NFP No Friggin Prisoners.

[Reply]

Ed Howes writes:

Amen Dina!

Lance, go get her. I just think she is an asset with the wrong point of view. Since you are bent on destruction when conversion is a good possibility, write those articles, call your legal sqaud and enjoy YOUR fight.

[Reply]

Christopher M. Knight writes:

Hey, I just watched Top Gun last night. My Tivo snagged it for what reason I have no idea. I watched it in fast forward to the good parts where they do an inverted negative 4g dive to take a polaroid of the enemy Mig.

Anyway…boys… be nice to Ms. Lawrence if you’re gonna engage her. :o) The last thing I wanted from this blog post is Ms. Lawrence getting attacked. Let’s show her respect through education and not a full attack.

[Reply]

Lance Winslow writes:

Indeed let’s have a limited war, those are more fun! We can many battles and if we start to get behind we pull out all the stops and go for Total Victory and annihilation of the enemy!!! If she can say those things about us in a sneak attack, then we sure as heck can have a reciprocal response. For get the political correctness, for get the diplomacy, we have been attacked on our own soil and we must therefore fully engage the enemy in the new paradigm of the Net-Centric Battlespace. We have the will to win and we must force our political will on the enemy.

This is more than just sabre rattling when she has used her mighty key board as machine gun against the purveyors of information to the World. Holding information up to the highest bidder as she desecrates the flag of fairness and the words of the righteous. We have nothing against the professional writer people, it is those radical fundamentalist leader writers we must dismiss from power and makes sure we get regime change, in the midst as we spread democracy, liberty and freedom to write what we will and recieve compensation and we chose.

[Reply]

Ed Howes writes:

Lance on fire. Pure desire.

[Reply]

Lance Winslow writes:

Well so far I have turned our sound and fury into 12 articles on the subject, more to follow.

[Reply]

Christopher M. Knight writes:

I’d prefer to never see any articles that mention Ms. Lawrence.

Attacking or naming her solves nothing but addressing the ARGUMENT can lead to understanding.

I appreciate everyone who comes to defend the article marketing & syndication model that we all participate in…

Let’s keep our discussion POSITIVE, ok? :-)

[Reply]

Edward Weiss writes:

See what you’ve started Chris? Once Lance is unleashed, there’s no telling what might happen. :)

[Reply]

Ed Howes writes:

Re: Professionalizing the internet – the following with permission:

Would you like to encourage submissions in all categories? Send an Email acknowledgement and thank you to contributors after submission. Send an Email notice and thank you to submitter upon publication of their submission. The lack of manners and courtesy in cyberspace is abhorrent and we all can make small adjustments to rectify this problem. This is the second time today I have shared this message with an otherwise great website.
Very Sincerely,

Ed Howes

Hi Mr. Howes,

Please accept my most sincere apologies for our lapse in courtesy in this area. I will not attempt to excuse our lack of manners in this area, I just promise to correct this issue. I have been a fan of your submissions for quite some time and sincerely hope that you will continue to support us with your attention.

Again, thank you for pointing out our oversight in this manner. You have done us a great service in insuring that we make sure that our contributing writers and artists enjoy a pleasant and rewarding experience with
NewYorkReview.Org. Please continue to reach out and let us know what you think.

Best Regards

Jay Greene

Jay,

There is a recent, very animated blog post and thread at EzineArticles on the subject of amateur versus professionals. Give me permission to post our exchange under just one sentence which reads. Professionalizing the internet – the following by permission. I will put the text in order and paste as a blog comment. This blog gets better by the day and you can make a wonderful contribution and generate some interest in NYR. Please Jay. Please?
Love,

Ed

Definitely, you have permission. That sounds awesome.

Thanks

Jay

NewYorkReview.Org

Thirty Nine Saint Paul’s Place
Suite Number Four
Brooklyn, New York 11226

e: jgreene@newyorkreview.org
w: http://newyorkreview.org

[Reply]

Lance Winslow writes:

I just have one question is Ms Lawrence the Ann Lawrence who writes trashy romance novels? Yes or No? If YES, then writers like that are destroying literature in the present period and the long tradition of literary work which makes writing so important to human history and education. These romance novels are in my opinion; NOT professional, it akin to selling soft porn. That is my opinion, without malice or making the porn industry look bad on Ms. Lawrence’s account. So if this is someone’s idea of a professional writer then I am hereby under whelmed no matter how many pesky cats someone has in their family.

Additionally, I have worked hard to write lots of articles, it takes time and effort. And to that point, when someone attacks what I stand for I take it personal and anyone who doesn’t does not take their endeavors personal and I wonder why they bother if they do not care enough about what they do to stand up for it. You must stand up for what you believe in.

Open positive dialogue with someone; Ms Lawrence; who opens with such snide, persnickety and rude comments, No Way! Hokum walks and she deserves NO professionalism, understanding, empathy or anything else. That is pure unadulterated poppycock and political correctness. Look at that article she wrote? Someone built a website and quote; ‚¬“made $ .50 in Google Adsense?‚¬

Please, that is fraudulent, misrepresentation and misdirection with someone who has an axe to grind and it is simply not true of what this fast online article submission venue trend is about. I am right, I stand tall and NO ONE should be allowed to slam, this venue, especially when they have NO CLUE as to what they are talking about. Just because someone is deprived and can dream up Romance Novels and describe every detail of a sexual encounter that never happened does not make them an expert in this Online Article Submission Site Venue, nor does it give them the right to slam in an aggressive manner.

We must defend our destiny and eliminate the enemy!!! So there. Stand up for something in your life, that article she wrote is not OKAY, it is unacceptable and it is full of holes. It fantasy like a soft porn romance novel? Please spare me the liberal, whining, political correctness, perspective based excuses. It is wrong what she wrote and that is that. How about a little reality check that article was BS and everyone of the 25,000 authors here knows it too.

[Reply]

Dina Again writes:

It’s quitting time (sort of) and I’m back.

I just want to point out to dear Edward Howes that it’s not such a good idea to publish people’s addresses on blogs. Jay seems like a cool guy, but nowhere in his permission-granting email does it say “and please publish my second reply to your email, including my address.”

Just pivoting on the topic of professionalism with ya. ;)

Oh, and while you’re at it Ed, isn’t it time to start that survival group who can raise their own crops, subsist on legumes and conserve water? All this talk, no action… if you want to be the spokesman, fine, but go contact some farmers, just DO IT.

(Yeah, Ed. I read some of your articles.)

[Reply]

Ed Howes writes:

Hey Dina,

Good to have you back. I had permission to publish a larger exchange but never copied my response to his and the personal info is on the email and his web site. I was in a bit of a hurry and acted unprofessionally. I thank you for calling it to my attention.

Indeed, I should be doing so much I am not doing. On one hand I am not happy about this. On the other I feel no compulsion to explain myself. So although I could contribute so much more than I do, I’m learning and beg your patience and support. Thank you for reading my articles. I am honored and will sleep well tonight. Blessings.

[Reply]

Lance Winslow writes:

7000; Take That Ms. Lawrence.

[Reply]

Matthew C. Keegan writes:

I liked Ms. Lawrence’s article even though she may not fully understand what article marketing is all about. I agree with some of the other comments out there as her perspective is purely pre-internet. Here in 2006, Article Marketing is a terrific way to advertise. Shoot, I hardly ever use PPC schemes to bring in traffic.

Good for you, Dina. I, too, have prospered through EzineArticles. This site has brought me more work than any other article directory and I feel privileged to be able to log on, upload articles, and get back to work.

Regards,
Matt Keegan
http://www.thearticlewriter.com

[Reply]

Lance Winslow writes:

In an email to Star Lawrence; Ms Lawrence is not the Trashy Romance Novelist, she writes PR stuff for the Health Industry. I emailed her and wrote this:

“Indeed if you have true personal character you will retract that very negative story you wrote in such a vendictive and mean spirited way and apologize. Do it!”

She sent me back this; In a message dated 6/22/2006 10:37:49 PM Pacific Standard Time;

We are writing a followup–one guy is with you–OK to undervalue the work.

Thanks for writing.

Star

PS What a bossy and crabby letter. Do you get anywhere with those!?

—————

I told her to; Smile! Stay Healthy.

————–

It seems to me that Ms. Star Lawrence, can dish it out but not take it. She can trash the online article submission site venue completely and degrade 25,000 authors while she bakes in the Chandler, AZ sun at 115 degrees. She can tell the world we are why she cannot sell her writing. You know I ought to flood the market with 1000 health articles next month and contact all those customers of hers and give them free articles. She has no right to tell the amateur authors like me what I can and cannot write or most of the nearly 25,000 authors here. Additionally, attacking this site, where we have choosen to post our articles is unfathomable, irresponsible and vindictive. Also it is unbecoming of a professional writer to do so and therefore next month is my Health Article Month for 1000 articles and after running a 4-minute mile in college got plenty to say on fitness and health. This was the Business Article Month. Ms. Lawrence should not attack this writing article online submission site trend, nor should she tell anyone how to write, what to write or where to right it. You know I am write.

[Reply]

Ed Howes writes:

Addendum: Due to an error on my part, the exchange I had with Mr. Greene yesterday did not include my reply to his most gracious response. He sent it to me this morning:

Jay,

You can call me Ed, Mr. Greene. By your prompt and warm response you have confirmed what will be a warm and profitable partnership among people who care. You have multiplied the joy of partnership multi fold. I might come Blog with you if I can make some time. To Caring Success,

Ed

[Reply]

Lance Winslow writes:

If professional writers are so good, then they need not worry about a bunch of amateurs who write articles on online submission websites. Indeed it makes sense to improve their work and set the bar higher, additionally get back with reality of the market place and short attention span of the modern readers. Think on that aspect too.

If online article submission websites wish to cater to professional writers more. Open an online auction clearing house for what is posted on this site and highest bidder wins. Writers get paid, everyone is happy. But surely that will drive supply up and demand will show the true price points of the market place, with a slight upward bias hedge due to the competitive bidding factor in auctions. Competitive psychology 101, predicts this. Consider this truth as well.

You know professional writers need to tone it down and stop complaining about amateurs, because they are often the ones that have been reading all their work for so many years and one day said to them selves due to something they had been reading; I know more about this subject than the writer and the writing is not that good and well, I can do better than that. How do I know this goes thru reader’s minds? Well, lets just say it happen to me and so I took the initiative to put a little pen to paper and prove it to myself.

http://www.carwashguys.com/0021803_2.shtml

http://www.carwashguys.com/clinton.shtml

So, as the accidental amateur author of articles, really I am a seeker of knowledge and wish to inform the world. But have observed the behavior of many a so-called professional writer, we need to delete the world professional. Adding to this comment I see these self-proclaimed professional writers wishing to shore up the article supply on the Internet and doing so by trashing online article sites.

Without these 300,000 amateur articles, some by professional writers too, the supply diminishes, meaning the demand for writers goes up. When that happens writers hope to sell there work for more. Now then, what is the difference of an oil company playing around with supply side while in a strong demand trend to make the gasoline prices higher?

You see the liberal professional Bush Bashing writers want to do the same thing. How? By eliminating me, the online article author, and trashing online article submission sites so no one will use them and they will go away! Silly people such a strategy will not work. You cannot stop group of innovative entrepreneurs?

Never! Truth crushed to the ground with wicked words from detractors of a growing trend, will do nothing more than add chaos and controversy and give this trend the publicity boost it needs to Blast to the Moon. It is simple really and I have participated in winning markets and innovative new businesses enough to know it too. Trust me on this, if you are an amateur or professional; DO NOT MISS THE BOAT, work with the online article submission sites and adapt or ?

[Reply]

Christopher M. Knight writes:

Thanks to Donyell Nelson, she further clarified the (3) types of writers involved in this discussion:
http://www.donyell.com/blog

Here are the (3) types of writers that Donyell identified that each have different goals:

Content writers- Usually write articles for search engine optimization purposes. These articles are generally used to bring in adsense revenue. Most of the time they write for pennies because they don’t realize that companies will actually pay a nice amount for high quality articles.

Professional writers– This includes book authors, copywriters, journalists, magazine freelancers, etc.

Article marketing– When people write articles (for free) and submit them to ezines and article directories. They do this in hopes of establishing themselves as experts so that people will buy the product or service listed in the article resource box.

Nice job Donyell!

[Reply]

Ed Howes writes:

All of which are important parts of the EzineArticles community.

[Reply]

Jeanette Joy Fisher writes:

Look at all the fun I missed while hibernating! Dare I confess I was writing?

Ms Lawrence assumes that EzineArticles writers don’t get paid. Did she ask any of us writers?

Let me count the ways I get paid for submitting articles to my favorite article directory, EzineArticles.

My books have made the real estate investing best seller list several times on Amazon.

My websites get “waves of traffic” and sell my books. In fact, when I want to sell more books, all I need to do is submit two articles. When I direct traffic from my websites to my books on Amazon, sales spike.

Large groups, like the Las Vegas Investing Club with over 100 members and builder organizations, invited me to speak.

Bloomberg Radio called me for an interview after finding my articles on EzineArticles. Other producers call me–I don’t need to hire a publicist.

Money Matters TV show invited me to guest for half an hour after seeing my articles on EzineArticles.

Macmillan invited me to write the color article for the Encyclopedia coming out next year. Of course, the usual payment reporter-type writers get paid would never be equal to what I make.

A university saw my articles, went to one of my websites, and hired me.

The University of California hired me.

Harris Publications, New York, saw my articles on EzineArticles and bought them, as is. Maybe you’ve seen their magazines at your market checkout: Country Living, etc.

A major publisher offered to buy my books. I said no.

I made writer friends. (Thank you for your support during this past year of heartache.) Writing has been my therapy instead of drugs after losing my daughter. If I didn’t have articles to write, I’d be prone in a dark corner.

As Donyell Nelson describes the three categories of writers, I am all of these: I write for article marketing, content, and could be considered a professional writer. In fact, I wrote for the local newspaper in my home town years ago. I made more money fixing and flipping houses. I don’t want to be a professional writer. I want to write–what I want, without a boss, and when I feel like writing, without a deadline.

Joy to all you writers!

Jeanette

[Reply]

Jeanette Joy Fisher writes:

P. S. I wonder if “professional writers” get over 400,000 viewings of their articles…

Thank you Chris and team and WRITERS for EzineArticles!

[Reply]

Lance Winslow writes:

WOW, and I like the categories and I too feel in a way that I have participated in all three of those too. I have been paid for articles, co-authored “Franchising 101” and driven massive traffic to our think tank site as well and just cannot say enough good things about EzineArticles and believe every professional writer should use it to propel their efforts and every amateur writer in the Whole Wide World who has something to say should write an article for the rest of us in the world to see. Great stuff indeed as I hit 1000 articles written this month and 1.8 million article views. It is all good from where I sit. I can tell you this, although I am retired I get people emailing a few times a week demanding I go back to work and sell them a franchise, but I am retired I tell them? I can tell you I wish I would have had this site around from 1994 to 2002, I cannot imagine how much more I could have done.

[Reply]

Ed Howes writes:

Jeanette Joy,

Your absense is forgiven. Your testimonial belongs on the page by that name as well as here. You are an inspiration to us all. You are – Joy squared or Joy X Joy.

[Reply]

Susan Scharfman writes:

Regarding the Star of all the aforementioned comments: I’m sitting here bleeding all over my keyboard, having just sliced my thumb with recently sharpened kitchen knife. Just have to add my bloody two cents: All Right Already!!!

[Reply]

Christopher M. Knight writes:

I noticed Dina wrote a blog entry: “in defense of EzineArticles:”
http://wordfeeder.typepad.com/blog/2006/06/in_defense_of_e.html

I’ve always wondered if it was spelled “Defense” vs. “Defence” :)

[Reply]

Dina writes:

Hold up Knight, are you challenging my spelling ability? ;)

Yes, defense is the correct spelling, although I’d bet that “defence” is the UK or perhaps Indian way.

Thanks for posting this link, but I don’t want to be responsible for sending Susan Scharfman over the edge and having her lose a finger

(I did the exact same thing as she did while chopping potatoes two days ago by the way).

Anyway, thanks for posting my article link.

Dina

[Reply]

Lance Winslow writes:

Chopping onions for “Stir Fry” is more dangerous. I was using Dina’s excellent stir fry recipe here on this site;

http://ezinearticles.com/?The-Wonderful-Wok:-Stir-Frying-Basics&id=21322

and sliced my finger cutting onions, I cried not because it hurt, but because those darn onions water my eyes, I found it hard to see while I was distracted fantasizing on drafting off Lance Armstrong’s airflow and Chris was there too and we were flying towards the finish line as Team USA, some of the French Professional Spectators were spitting and boo’ing. We one the race anyway, too bad for the detractors.

[Reply]

Susan Scharfman writes:

Dina: I’m always either just on or a little bit over the (razor’s) edge. Besides, I’ve been getting so much sympathy over my wound, I think my thumb will heal very slowly. And yes, defence is UK, as is colour.

I think we owe our Star detractor a note of thanks. How else would all of us have had the benefit of more Lancets and significant other gems?

My thought for the day: All that separates the successful from the wannabes is a thick skin and hard work. Cheers! Susan

[Reply]

Lance Winslow writes:

Very Correct Susan,

We must thank Rats (sorry dyslexic, I truly made a mistake, I mean to say Star) for her scathing, spiteful and surprise attack on the Online Article Submission venue and all the 27,237 Authors sharing their best efforts here at EzineArticles.com and I should thank her personally for allowing free flowing commentary of 24 articles on this subject in reciprocal response for her 911 style ambush using her machine gun word processor now that she has upgraded from a mighty sword.

Additionally it is very nice to see inside the true mind of a Professional Writer and what she really thinks of amateur writers. The same types of people who ones hired her. As an entrepreneur I use to hire writers for things; manuals, marketing and other. In doing this I always suspected a jealousy and inner rage and character flaw there in many of the professional writers, not all. But if this is how they treat their own industry or a sub-sector of it and if this is how they really think, then it appears to me that other writers ought to be having something to say about her comments.

If the real Professional Writers do not speak out against her slanderous remarks then they are condoning it and in doing so they are not with us, but against us, cheering on a detractor of online article submission sites. So, I take issue with this and consider her attacks more than a pricked finger from a kitchen knife, but a Foil, Epee or Sabre swing of the sword and a thrust-ful forward burst and although she is no Errol Flynn or Three Muskateer her moves do require a counter-attack and deservedly so.

[Reply]

Ed Howes writes:

Not so Lance,

The link from EzineArticles likely doubled her views. Don’t assume that more than a few hundred pros read her article. Half of those may be engaged in article marketing and they just don’t care what she says or how often she says it. It was a small scandal and it brought forth some powerful testimonials here on this blog and a few others. She is probably getting more promotion here than anywhere else, Everything works out over time.

[Reply]

Lance Winslow writes:

Great Points Ed,

You are correct in that the traffic generated from EzineArticles over this issue did improve the views of her article. But if someone is so against article writing online, then why write an ARTICLE to say so? Ah, maybe because it works? Well, is that not interesting.

Personally this issue does not concern me much, as her comments are not true and therefore irrelevant. Nevertheless she brought up a point of contention worthy of assisting me in my goals to write more articles. And when she attacks online article submission venue and the amateur writers like me, she inadverantly showed her true feelings and inner thoughts of other up and coming writers and attempted to put up a barrier to entry of protectionism, by slandering in an attempt to diminish online article submission sites.

If someone HATES amateur authors and they are a professional writer then they hate themselves. Because that article she wrote, she did not get paid for and she was once an amateur herself. Yet forgot from hence she came.

I do not assume more than a few hundred of anybody read her dribble and you are correct. And of the Professional Writers out there, well any of the SMART ones probably are involved in using online article submission websites as a marketing tool.

You are correct Ed, it was a very small scandal until I got a hold of it and thank you for posting and allowing me to reply to keep this scandal growing until it smothers the scathing, slanderous and slamming surprise attacker.

You are correct Ed when you state; ‚¬“She is probably getting more promotion here than anywhere else, Everything works out over time.‚¬

Yes she is getting lots of publicity here, thus that does two things; Number One, it shows her the value of this website and the power of online article submissions and Two it stops her complaining about little amateur article authors like me making her a poor, pathetic and starving writer, because maybe she will get some work out of all this and button it.

So Ed any thoughts on this comment as I turn it into 2-more articles on the subject making it now 28, and articles number 7243 and 7244?

[Reply]

Ed Howes writes:

It goes all the way back to Chris’ observation that she was comparing apples to oranges or bike shoes for running. A case of mistaken identity. She may also have alerted any number of pros that they might just want 10,000 feeding on their articles. Where else in E media does this occur? Hence every damage she might have caused may be offset in ways that have little or nothing to do with you or me except to give us more to talk about. I am glad she spoke about it and shared her opinion, however misguided and you have practically said the same.

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Lance Winslow writes:

This is so true and yes it has shed some light on the subject. Now we must seek out another purveyor of falsehoods about the online article submission category so we have more to discuss!!!

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Ramon Greenwood writes:

I’m a relative newcomer to the word of e-zine articles and I need all the help I can get.

Specifically, can someone tell me whether or not one of the set ups to mass distribute articles to directories is worthwhile?

It just seems to me that since most directories and ezines have different formats for submitting articles, it would be extremely, if not impossible, for one of these systems to work.

Advice, please.

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Ed Howes writes:

Ramon,

The trend is moving from quantity of placement for articles to quality. EzineArticles is one of few high quality directories and I am currently getting more views on a low quality directory than here. That might continue but probably not for a year. This blog and the testimonial page testifies to the benefits of publishing articles here and elsewhere. Writers who once submitted to dozens or even hundreds of directories are learning to be happy with a few that produce the best results. It almost takes as much time to find the good ones as to submit to 100 indiscriminately but you might be able to find one good directory per month, once you learn what to look for and your articles have been picked up and republished in more and more places. You can then do a web search on any article that has been picked up here 2 or 3 times and maybe find that same article in a dozen locations, each of which you can visit and evaluate. If you want to become a master article marketer, read, listen to and watch what today’s masters are saying and doing.

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Jay Aaron writes:

Hello all.

Jeanette Fisher infomed me of this discussion, and I’m so glad she did.

Please do not count me in on the war – vindictive or otherwise – against Star Lawrence. I believe everyone has the right to their own opinion. The truth will always out.

Instead, I simply offer the following question to Ms. Lawrence – and everyone else, if that’s possible. You can apply this question to any belief, and any action:

“How (well) is that (what you’re doing, or what you believe) working for you?”

What we’re learning in this discussion is that people who embrace free article submissions – for whatever reason(s) they choose – receive benefits that they seek, even when those benefits are non-monetary. So it seems that for those who choose to use EzineArticles.com and other article submission sites, what they do is working well – in some cases very well – for them. And as has been pointed out, earning for them non-monetary and monetary rewards.

So my question to Ms. Star is simply:

“How well is what you’re doing working for you? Are your beliefs about free article submissions bringing you what you wish to receive?”

To be honest, I cannot tell from Ms. Lawrence’s article what she wanted in return for having written and submitted it. If it was notariety, she seems to have gotten it – at least on this blog. If that was her intent, then what she did by writing that article worked well. But if she had other intentions, it would be interesting to learn if what she did provided the results she sought.

And then there is the marketing perspective…

Ms. Lawrence used a link in her article that sends people directly to her blog. (I’ve got to admit, curiosity got the best of me. I clicked through…) I’d be totally surprised if she uses any site/visitor tracking, which would have given her valuable information about where her visitors were coming from, and what they did once they arrived. Had she used a tracked link in her article, she’d have more information that could lead to income opportunities than she could shake a stick at. (Is it proper to end a sentence with a preposition?)

At her blog, there is no place to opt in to receive her (non-existent) newsletter, free or not. Marketing research indicates that people need to have five exposures to something before they build up enough trust, liking and familiarity to take an action – including returning to a Web site (blog or otherwise) they’ve visited only once. Without communicating regularly with her site visitors on their own terms, in their own inboxes, Ms. Lawrence is passing up many opportunities – including ones that would result in her receiving income.

By sending readers of her article directly to her blog, Ms. Lawrence also missed the opportunity to send them to a Web page that could have increased her Web visibility and who knows what else.

I’d have put up a visitor survey, asking them whether they were in favour of her argument, or against it, and asking for their comments. Then I’d publish the results (professionally of course, if I could sell the article), making sure to tell the truth about what people fell and think, even if it differed from my argument.

I’d have also offered a “free report” either about the profession of writing and/or about some aspect of health (her field of expertise) in return for an opt-in e-mail address that would allow her to stay in touch with people and bring them deeper into her fold, like her opinions or not.

And, certainly, I’d provide a (tracked) link to the blog from this Web page.

Whew, that’s a lot to mull over…

Hope I’ve added some value to this discussion.

Jay Aaron

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Maria Marsala, Author, Marketing Strategist, and former Wall Street Trader writes:

I fully understand Ms. Lawrence’s way of looking at writing, etc. etc. Her business is about writing. That’s what she’s paid for, and that’s what she works diligently to accomplish, it’s her craft and business.

I have worked with many business owners in the writing fields and had conversations with them about the topic of free articles, etc. Some will write a few articles to post to article banks and some don’t find the value in doing so. Years ago, when I ran my article submission service, a copywriter who was bringing his writing to the web paid me to submit his articles. I submitted 5 or 10, I forget exactly. A few weeks later, I received a note from him about the traffic that his not site received, the number of inquires he received and that he has 10 new clients from the posting I did for him! A great return on his money.

My own story is different. I don’t consider myself a writer. English was on the bottom of my thoughts as I went through school. However, I have accumulated a lot of knowledge. And it’s what my first coach said to write down in my first article. I can look over the last 8 years in business and say that I doubt I’d be in business had I not started writing articles and submitting them to the article banks. Marketing a business which many couldn’t understand back then (coaching) was not easy and additionally, I was living in rural America at the time. The Internet, in all its written words, gave me an opportunity I wouldn’t have ever had otherwise.

Writing my first article and showing it to my coach, gave me added confidence at a time in my business that I really, really needed it. It opened opportunities like: bringing pre-qualified traffic to my web site (not just traffic, but the most important type of traffic – pre-qualified – because business owners in my niche really liked my articles as they found them on a variety of web sites, came to my web site and subscribed to my Ezine.

I took that first article and turned it into my first paid workshop. $300 bucks! WOW.

A few hundred articles later, my articles end up in magazines, ezines, on web sites, used in other people’s classes (with payment of course), used in my classses, teleccoaching classes, Ebooks, CDs, audios, notes, ecourses, used in other people’s books, etc., etc., etc.

Because I wrote those articles and posted them to the web I get calls from freelancers at Money Magazine, NY Times, and Women’s Day, who wanted to interview me because of my business expertise. Even the first time I was on TV (in regards to my business) it was for a TV show on authors ‚¬€ and I was their first Internet Author. Ya, he found me on the Internet!

And I can’t forget the day when I received a call a magazine publisher about an article I wrote on cleaning your kitchen in 10 days (not my usual topic). They paid me $100 for an article that was 4 years old! Not bad for a little extra income.

So, as they say, there are two sides to this story and the controversy it breeds. For years, I have watch both sides! understand both sides, and even agree with both sides!

and I choose to continue to post articles…

and my Ezine!

and write ebooks…

and get my first book ready for the editor.

Why? Because turning my articles into cash which starts with writing and submitting articles to article banks is a good use of my time. It has helped me market my business to the masses; it has brought me new clients and ezine subscribers. It has brought me speaking engagements, interviews, $$$, all over the world. Writing articles has allowed me to become known as an expert in my niche market – service professionals.

I am one of the thousands upon thousands of online business owners who have learned that turning their knowledge into cash started by writing articles and posting them to the web.

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Carson writes:

I agree with the sentiment, but don’t care for the title… You see, I am a professional freelance writer specializing in web content and copywriting. I am also a fan of article-based marketing. Not only do I think it has value to writers in promoting their own efforts, it also creates a nice stream of work for many freelancers (I ghostwrite and edit many articles that appear on sites like yours for my clients).

They get the marketing advantage–I get the jobs. Everyone lives happily ever after while creating exposure, backlinks and direct traffic flow…

How about dropping the “s” in “professional writers” in the title? There are many of us who are squarely on the other side of the issue.

Carson Brackney
CONTENT DONE BETTER
http://www.contentdonebetter.com
http://content-writer.blogspot.com

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Ed Howes writes:

What a fantastic education this blog thread has become! May God bless the many contributors.

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